Rules for main forums
- Be nice
- No advertisement
- No events
- No fundraisers
- No topics asking for votes
- Only posts related to Brazilian Jiu Jitsu
Best instructional for BJJ (gi or nogi) standing?
6 year(s) ago • 732 views • 20 replies
HLPurple beltVerified
6 year(s) ago
I like Jorgen Matsi's instructional on BJJ Globetrotters inaction. I also like Stephen Whittiers Pillars Clinch and Takedowns. Both are BJJ oriented. I've followed some wrestling and judo instructionals. but its not the same as BJJ. Opponents skill and reactions are different and also goal of a takedown or gripfighting is not the same.
I wonder what would it take to make a good instructional for beginning a match. Does anyone know any?
I wonder what would it take to make a good instructional for beginning a match. Does anyone know any?
CGBlack belt 4th degreeVerified
6 year(s) ago
I think first step - outside of any instructionals - is for instructors to have more focus on standup part of Jiu Jitsu. I've always found it a liiiittle bit weird that when ever you walk into a Jiu Jitsu academy, anywhere in the world, literally everyone is just laying down. Personally, I think both technique, drilling and sparring should be 50/50 standup and ground.
TPBlack beltVerified
6 year(s) ago
I think Salamone's "BJJ Wrestling Plan" is excellent (except maybe for production quality), especially since it's nowadays up in YouTube officially for free.
8 modules, 150 videos. No-gi.
https://www.youtube.com/c[...]/playlists
8 modules, 150 videos. No-gi.
https://www.youtube.com/c[...]/playlists
TPBlack beltVerified
6 year(s) ago
I think first step - outside of any instructionals - is for instructors to have more focus on standup part of Jiu Jitsu. I've always found it a liiiittle bit weird that when ever you walk into a Jiu Jitsu academy, anywhere in the world, literally everyone is just laying down. Personally, I think both technique, drilling and sparring should be 50/50 standup and ground.
Maybe a bit offtopic, but I loved how somebody described the higher belts' Master division matches in the Europeans to me: "It's 4,5 minutes of bad judo and then somebody pulls guard" (the matches are 5mins). :D
There in fact seems to be a massive differences in Adults vs. Masters in this area: I watched the purple/brown belts Adults and even in middleweight and a few classes heavier it was an immediate guard pull or double guard pull in more than 90% of the matches. Same belts & weight but Master 2 and above: almost everybody tries a takedown or stays standing and pulling is a way later resort. (Only a few, who looked like obvs pullers, pull right away.)
But anyway: if you're a young gun competitor nowadays, training 50:50 stand-up : ground game is stupid because nobody stands for a fraction of a second if they can avoid it... (just train stalling in 50-50 guard instead and you're good to go!)
There in fact seems to be a massive differences in Adults vs. Masters in this area: I watched the purple/brown belts Adults and even in middleweight and a few classes heavier it was an immediate guard pull or double guard pull in more than 90% of the matches. Same belts & weight but Master 2 and above: almost everybody tries a takedown or stays standing and pulling is a way later resort. (Only a few, who looked like obvs pullers, pull right away.)
But anyway: if you're a young gun competitor nowadays, training 50:50 stand-up : ground game is stupid because nobody stands for a fraction of a second if they can avoid it... (just train stalling in 50-50 guard instead and you're good to go!)
Edited 6 year(s) ago
GGBlack belt 1st degreeVerifiedScotland
6 year(s) ago
I think first step - outside of any instructionals - is for instructors to have more focus on standup part of Jiu Jitsu. I've always found it a liiiittle bit weird that when ever you walk into a Jiu Jitsu academy, anywhere in the world, literally everyone is just laying down. Personally, I think both technique, drilling and sparring should be 50/50 standup and ground.
That was the reason I insisted on having the floor in my gym sprung, so we could do throws and takedowns without dying - it seems to have worked, as most of my students start rounds standing, and actually pursue takedowns. We're also lucky enough to have a few members with wrestling and judo knowledge.
As for instructionals, I've found Adam Wheeler's 'Upper Body Takedowns for Grappling' very useful!
As for instructionals, I've found Adam Wheeler's 'Upper Body Takedowns for Grappling' very useful!
WJBlack belt 2nd degreeVerified
6 year(s) ago
I think first step - outside of any instructionals - is for instructors to have more focus on standup part of Jiu Jitsu. I've always found it a liiiittle bit weird that when ever you walk into a Jiu Jitsu academy, anywhere in the world, literally everyone is just laying down. Personally, I think both technique, drilling and sparring should be 50/50 standup and ground.
When Im teaching I try and always cover at least one takedown before moving onto other technique. This is a mix from my own wrestling background and the limited Judo I know, but I am lucky enough to have some high level Judokas that can help out when needed.
Sparring in my classes always starts from standing unless for safety when the class numbers are high or particularly highly balanced towards newbies we start from the knees.
Other than always standing!
Sparring in my classes always starts from standing unless for safety when the class numbers are high or particularly highly balanced towards newbies we start from the knees.
Other than always standing!
Edited 6 year(s) ago
CGBlack belt 4th degreeVerified
6 year(s) ago
But anyway: if you're a young gun competitor nowadays, training 50:50 stand-up : ground game is stupid because nobody stands for a fraction of a second if they can avoid it... (just train stalling in 50-50 guard instead and you're good to go!)
Totally agree, that's also why I wrote "personally", since it is very different if you only train for competition. I try to teach my students to be as well rounded grapplers as possible in all situations and with all types of clothing (naked too, yes).
HLPurple beltVerified
6 year(s) ago
I've seen an instructional done by old judokas where they spar ( randori) standing, but do the throws only to the pivoting point when balance is lost and opponent would fall down. Second nice idea was from Jukkis https://www.youtube.com/c[...]bcMQwx_K1g . For BJJ you do not get more points for ippon throws - you need to control the takedown so that you have control of opponents body on the mat.
So after you have unbalanced your opponent with a trip or a throw to the point when they fall down - assist - carry their weight and same time take your controlling or passing grips.
This makes drilling takedowns soft and safe - and affective for BJJ. Any thoughts?
Have to start checking out the link Tatu wrote. And also BJJ Globetrotters Inaction is live again. It has also Mariuz Grzywinski's instructional from 2020 winter camp. Good stuff:-) Have check Christian's wrestling instructionals once more. I think it was 2 or 3 years ago in a nogi suit.
So after you have unbalanced your opponent with a trip or a throw to the point when they fall down - assist - carry their weight and same time take your controlling or passing grips.
This makes drilling takedowns soft and safe - and affective for BJJ. Any thoughts?
Have to start checking out the link Tatu wrote. And also BJJ Globetrotters Inaction is live again. It has also Mariuz Grzywinski's instructional from 2020 winter camp. Good stuff:-) Have check Christian's wrestling instructionals once more. I think it was 2 or 3 years ago in a nogi suit.
KWBlack belt 1st degreeVerified
JMBlack belt 2nd degreeVerified
6 year(s) ago
Ever repeating cycle for the past 15 years:
In my gym a lot of people want to learn standup wrestling/judo. We schedule a regular standup class. After 3-4 of those majority of participants start to ask if we could stick to the ground stuff. Rinse and repeat.
Wrestling is hard.
In my gym a lot of people want to learn standup wrestling/judo. We schedule a regular standup class. After 3-4 of those majority of participants start to ask if we could stick to the ground stuff. Rinse and repeat.
Wrestling is hard.
HLPurple beltVerified
6 year(s) ago
This is one of my absolute favourite wrestling series! https://youtu.be/VAUZMUMsRYY
Very good wrestling series. It's not difficult to find high quality wrestling. One that I like is https://www.kolat.com/
I find it more challenging to find BJJ takedowns. I think that judo and sampo make the throws too hard - you loose connection of your opponent and it's more difficult to continue on the mat. Wrestling has a bias on opponents pulling guard or landing on their backs.
I think my goal is to find some very easy ways to get in to a tieup or a setup ( maybe one or two different ones) - and have few different - easy options to opponents reactions to the tieups and end on the mat with passing opponents guard or atleast in a very good position to pass opponents guard.
I find it more challenging to find BJJ takedowns. I think that judo and sampo make the throws too hard - you loose connection of your opponent and it's more difficult to continue on the mat. Wrestling has a bias on opponents pulling guard or landing on their backs.
I think my goal is to find some very easy ways to get in to a tieup or a setup ( maybe one or two different ones) - and have few different - easy options to opponents reactions to the tieups and end on the mat with passing opponents guard or atleast in a very good position to pass opponents guard.
HLPurple beltVerified
6 year(s) ago
Ever repeating cycle for the past 15 years: In my gym a lot of people want to learn standup wrestling/judo. We schedule a regular standup class. After 3-4 of those majority of participants start to ask if we could stick to the ground stuff. Rinse and repeat. Wrestling is hard.
Same happened in Martin Aedma's gym last year :-)
We are having a seminar "Takedowns for dummies" in two weeks...
We are having a seminar "Takedowns for dummies" in two weeks...
Edited 6 year(s) ago
HLPurple beltVerified
6 year(s) ago
Wrestling is hard.
Does it have to be hard? I watched a seminar about wrestling and instructor on it said that BJJ has done good marketing stating that it's for everyone. He claims wrestling could be for everyone too - just keep it technical and use progressive resistance like BJJ. Something kind of chain wrestling?
(I've been working on beach wrestling for a while and even it turns to using muscle. It's much in the nature of humans to fight hard back - not clever. Talking about me... lately I have had to try to find more clever, technical ways to counter, because speed and stregth has "left the building" about 20 - 30 years ago.)
(I've been working on beach wrestling for a while and even it turns to using muscle. It's much in the nature of humans to fight hard back - not clever. Talking about me... lately I have had to try to find more clever, technical ways to counter, because speed and stregth has "left the building" about 20 - 30 years ago.)
TPBlack beltVerified
6 year(s) ago
Does it have to be hard? I watched a seminar about wrestling and instructor on it said that BJJ has done good marketing stating that it's for everyone. He claims wrestling could be for everyone too - just keep it technical and use progressive resistance like BJJ. Something kind of chain wrestling?
Just doing "chain wrestling" or standing drills for most of the class is a lot more tiring than laying on your back & flapping your feet around. And everything oughta be practiced with some degree of resistance too for it to be of any use, and that when it gets hard...
KWBlack belt 1st degreeVerified
6 year(s) ago
Does it have to be hard? I watched a seminar about wrestling and instructor on it said that BJJ has done good marketing stating that it's for everyone. He claims wrestling could be for everyone too - just keep it technical and use progressive resistance like BJJ. Something kind of chain wrestling? (I've been working on beach wrestling for a while and even it turns to using muscle. It's much in the nature of humans to fight hard back - not clever. Talking about me... lately I have had to try to find more clever, technical ways to counter, because speed and stregth has 'left the building' about 20 - 30 years ago.)
This is why I often prefer the Russian approach to wrestling. Very focused on drilling and chaining, going into positions before the takedowns.
DKBlue beltVerified
6 year(s) ago
I think first step - outside of any instructionals - is for instructors to have more focus on standup part of Jiu Jitsu. I've always found it a liiiittle bit weird that when ever you walk into a Jiu Jitsu academy, anywhere in the world, literally everyone is just laying down. Personally, I think both technique, drilling and sparring should be 50/50 standup and ground.
This is exactly how I run my freestyle judo school. 50/50 standing to ground. A 2 hour session goes in half hour intervals, half hour for warm up/stretch, one for standing technique, 1 for ground technique and 1 for rolling.
Totally legit. And a ton of fun with how diverse it is. Couldn't get behind it more. Of course, rules (usually) dictate the training sadly... One of the reasons I'm freestyle judo and not IJF lol. But maybe I'm biased? Idk lmao
Totally legit. And a ton of fun with how diverse it is. Couldn't get behind it more. Of course, rules (usually) dictate the training sadly... One of the reasons I'm freestyle judo and not IJF lol. But maybe I'm biased? Idk lmao
Edited 6 year(s) ago
JMBlack belt 2nd degreeVerified
6 year(s) ago
Just doing 'chain wrestling' or standing drills for most of the class is a lot more tiring than laying on your back & flapping your feet around. And everything oughta be practiced with some degree of resistance too for it to be of any use, and that when it gets hard...
-insert (!) erection jokes here-
TPBlack beltVerified
6 year(s) ago
-insert (!) erection jokes here-
No shame in getting a boner from seeing great wrestling!
VJBlack belt 2nd degreeVerified
6 year(s) ago
I suggest that if you expect to have a solid takedown foundation, you have to study wrestling. John Smith’s Oklahoma State system will translate. Single-legs are low-risk/high reward. The concepts of setup, execution, and transition in wrestling will teach you how to get to side control and the back. Wrestling directly affects position before submission. Watch the white belt former D1 wrestler run through everyone and be unable to finish. BJJ is the natural progression of wrestling. On a pure BJJ level, I think Andre Galvao has effectively incorporated takedown concepts.
HLPurple beltVerified
6 year(s) ago
you have to study wrestling. John Smith’s Oklahoma State system will translate.
Good news is that there are a lot of videos on youtube showing John Smith coaching. Bad news is that mimicing a wrestler will be hard work and demands a lot of skill.
