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Coach Against student starting new BJJ Event.
4 year(s) ago • 3057 views • 29 replies
Purple beltVerified
4 year(s) ago
So.... I live in a quite large city in spain, where there are quite a few BJJ gyms but not much BJJ community nor events. Over the last few months I have been trying to start a new event here ,1 predetermined fight a night for fighter, not a full blown competition .... hopefully that will come at a later stage.
During my planning one of the biggest things was finding a place/ gym to host the event, as well as insurance, and many other things.
Once I had the main points in place I decided to ask my coach if it was possible I could ask in our WhatsApp group if anyone would like to fight at the event and if anyone would like to help out.....
My coach declined my request and told me that he does not support the event. His reason were 1-He was not the first to be informed of the event, I think he has been informed of my planning as I have asked place to host the event and those places know him and told him of it. 2- He held an inter club a few weeks back and I did not participate (as I am not currently wanting to fight) nor did I offer my help refereeing or arranging things (I am not confident in my knowledge of the points to ref, and my communication/ organisation skills aren't great especially in a second language.
I have apologised to him for both things, but I told him I am going forward with the event. And now there seems to be a tension in the room.
Am I in the wrong for wanting to carry on with the event? Should I have informed him of the event while it was just an idea without anything in place?
I know I need to speak to him to sort this out, and I will. but I would like to know what you would do?
I want to be diplomatic but he's also advises other students not to go to seminars (with legends) because its at a gym he doesn't get on with.
im interested in your thoughts.
Thanks
During my planning one of the biggest things was finding a place/ gym to host the event, as well as insurance, and many other things.
Once I had the main points in place I decided to ask my coach if it was possible I could ask in our WhatsApp group if anyone would like to fight at the event and if anyone would like to help out.....
My coach declined my request and told me that he does not support the event. His reason were 1-He was not the first to be informed of the event, I think he has been informed of my planning as I have asked place to host the event and those places know him and told him of it. 2- He held an inter club a few weeks back and I did not participate (as I am not currently wanting to fight) nor did I offer my help refereeing or arranging things (I am not confident in my knowledge of the points to ref, and my communication/ organisation skills aren't great especially in a second language.
I have apologised to him for both things, but I told him I am going forward with the event. And now there seems to be a tension in the room.
Am I in the wrong for wanting to carry on with the event? Should I have informed him of the event while it was just an idea without anything in place?
I know I need to speak to him to sort this out, and I will. but I would like to know what you would do?
I want to be diplomatic but he's also advises other students not to go to seminars (with legends) because its at a gym he doesn't get on with.
im interested in your thoughts.
Thanks
Black belt 1st degreeVerified
4 year(s) ago
If your values around BJJ and your coaches don't align maybe it's time to look for a new gym?
If your event is going to help BJJ grow in your area then you should do it.
If your event is going to help BJJ grow in your area then you should do it.
Black belt 4th degreeVerified
4 year(s) ago
The thing about it is a bigger deal than just your event. Nowadays, they are à lot of People who organise event but do not have the abilities or the rank to get credit for that... in Belgium, some guys start to organise competitions with a calendar of maybe 6 or 7 tournaments per year, it is pretty cool to have the opportunity to fight but, in this case it is stricly business and the organisator don't know so much about it and when He has to decide something about a rules he's lost.
My opinion about it, is that it is pretty Nice that you want to makes things move but, as a blue belt, as you says you feel not confident enough and it is normal, so that's why i don't understand why you didn't talk first to your coach about it...it's normal that's is mad on you specialy if he discover it by kind of accident speaking with someone who now about it... if the same happened in my gym i would be mad also, if you train under him you should have one kind of relationship so at least he deserved to know it by you telling him... about his reaction against seminars in others gym, it is a old school way of thinking, but as someone says above, you're free to leave this gym if you feel you're not at your place. But if you stay you have to follow the dojo rules
My opinion about it, is that it is pretty Nice that you want to makes things move but, as a blue belt, as you says you feel not confident enough and it is normal, so that's why i don't understand why you didn't talk first to your coach about it...it's normal that's is mad on you specialy if he discover it by kind of accident speaking with someone who now about it... if the same happened in my gym i would be mad also, if you train under him you should have one kind of relationship so at least he deserved to know it by you telling him... about his reaction against seminars in others gym, it is a old school way of thinking, but as someone says above, you're free to leave this gym if you feel you're not at your place. But if you stay you have to follow the dojo rules
Purple beltVerified
4 year(s) ago
Thank you for your comments,
As soon as I/we realised it was possible and wanted to start to see if fighters were interested we spoke to him. I Didn't tell him before as we didn't feel the need to have him part of the organisation. I am confident that I can arrange an event (I am not confident to be a ref or a front man), another person who is doing this with me has studied sports event organisation at university.
I think he found out speaking to another gym. He doesn't own the gym we train in, its a martial arts gym and he does the BJJ classes. I would have asked the owners of the gym to have the event there, but its too small.
As soon as I/we realised it was possible and wanted to start to see if fighters were interested we spoke to him. I Didn't tell him before as we didn't feel the need to have him part of the organisation. I am confident that I can arrange an event (I am not confident to be a ref or a front man), another person who is doing this with me has studied sports event organisation at university.
I think he found out speaking to another gym. He doesn't own the gym we train in, its a martial arts gym and he does the BJJ classes. I would have asked the owners of the gym to have the event there, but its too small.
Black belt 4th degreeVerified
4 year(s) ago
Thank you for your comments, As soon as I/we realised it was possible and wanted to start to see if fighters were interested we spoke to him. I Didn't tell him before as we didn't feel the need to have him part of the organisation. I am confident that I can arrange an event (I am not confident to be a ref or a front man), another person who is doing this with me has studied sports event organisation at university. I think he found out speaking to another gym. He doesn't own the gym we train in, its a martial arts gym and he does the BJJ classes. I would have asked the owners of the gym to have the event there, but its too small.
You didn't need him on the organisation but just by respect, if i was you i did told him since the beginning. If he teach you the art and spend time for you that's not a huge sacrifice to be honest. I know that a lot of people didn't think that way but you have to respect your professor. And he have to respect you as well.
Black belt 4th degreeVerified
4 year(s) ago
His reason were 1-He was not the first to be informed of the event
Since when should any adult have anything to say on what businesses other adults want to start.

Edited 4 year(s) ago
Black belt 4th degreeVerified
4 year(s) ago
Since when should any adult have anything to say on what businesses other adults want to start.
Sorry but i can't agree with you on this one
Black belt 1st degreeVerified
4 year(s) ago
You don't have to tell your coach a goddam thing. Lol. And why can't a blue belt run a tournament? If your organizational and people management skills are on point, you don't have to have anything to do with the technicalities which would otherwise be handled by the right people who you hire/organize.
I wish you the best of luck in your venture, and don't let anybody get into your head with all this honor and loyalty bullshit.
I wish you the best of luck in your venture, and don't let anybody get into your head with all this honor and loyalty bullshit.
Black belt 3rd degreeVerified
4 year(s) ago
Since when should any adult have anything to say on what businesses other adults want to start.
THIS 100% truth
Purple beltVerified
4 year(s) ago
You didn't need him on the organisation but just by respect, if i was you i did told him since the beginning. If he teach you the art and spend time for you that's not a huge sacrifice to be honest. I know that a lot of people didn't think that way but you have to respect your professor. And he have to respect you as well.
how would someone be able to fix the relationship with you, if they have done what I have.
because at the end of the day I don't want anyone pissed off and I want to keep the event going. And id also like some of my team mates to fight at the event.
I want to know how to fix things. I don't want to trash anyone.
because at the end of the day I don't want anyone pissed off and I want to keep the event going. And id also like some of my team mates to fight at the event.
I want to know how to fix things. I don't want to trash anyone.
Black belt 4th degreeVerified
4 year(s) ago
how would someone be able to fix the relationship with you, if they have done what I have. because at the end of the day I don't want anyone pissed off and I want to keep the event going. And id also like some of my team mates to fight at the event. I want to know how to fix things. I don't want to trash anyone.
The way i saw things was like :
" hey coach, i think seriously about making my own event, it can be a good thing for the gym also, a good publicity and maybe à good experience for m'y team mates who gonna compete, what do you think about it, can you give me some advise or helping me to make it happen ?"
Just this way, you're coach can be a part or not but that's his own choice and you didn't do it on his back, again this is my point of view.
The idea of a forum is to talk, relax and to respect each others, i have the right to think what i think, i respect others members point of view.
" hey coach, i think seriously about making my own event, it can be a good thing for the gym also, a good publicity and maybe à good experience for m'y team mates who gonna compete, what do you think about it, can you give me some advise or helping me to make it happen ?"
Just this way, you're coach can be a part or not but that's his own choice and you didn't do it on his back, again this is my point of view.
The idea of a forum is to talk, relax and to respect each others, i have the right to think what i think, i respect others members point of view.
Purple beltVerified
4 year(s) ago
The way i saw things was like : ' hey coach, i think seriously about making my own event, it can be a good thing for the gym also, a good publicity and maybe à good experience for m'y team mates who gonna compete, what do you think about it, can you give me some advise or helping me to make it happen ?' Just this way, you're coach can be a part or not but that's his own choice and you didn't do it on his back, again this is my point of view. The idea of a forum is to talk, relax and to respect each others, i have the right to think what i think, i respect others members point of view.
I know now, this is what I should have done. But what can I do to fix it now, now that he has said he doesn't support the event, and he doesn't want me to ask his/ our team to fight at the event.
Black belt 4th degreeVerified
4 year(s) ago
I know now, this is what I should have done. But what can I do to fix it now, now that he has said he doesn't support the event, and he doesn't want me to ask his/ our team to fight at the event.
It seems that it would be difficult to fix it...
Without knowinv the guy it is hard to say how he gonna react and what will work on him, some people, would change their mind after some apologies and asking them to be part of it...some didn't care and would stay on their positions... hard to say
Without knowinv the guy it is hard to say how he gonna react and what will work on him, some people, would change their mind after some apologies and asking them to be part of it...some didn't care and would stay on their positions... hard to say
Black belt 4th degreeVerified
4 year(s) ago
The way i saw things was like : " hey coach, i think seriously about making my own event, it can be a good thing for the gym also, a good publicity and maybe à good experience for m'y team mates who gonna compete, what do you think about it, can you give me some advise or helping me to make it happen ?" Just this way, you're coach can be a part or not but that's his own choice and you didn't do it on his back, again this is my point of view.
Why does he "owe" his instructor to have the opportunity to be part of his business idea?
Unless you're under a non-compete contractual obligation, I don't see why the coach has anything to say in this.
Unless you're under a non-compete contractual obligation, I don't see why the coach has anything to say in this.
Black belt 1st degreeVerified
4 year(s) ago
Why does he 'owe' his instructor to have the opportunity to be part of his business idea? Unless you're under a non-compete contractual obligation, I don't see why the coach has anything to say in this.
Absolutely. And furthermore, the coach should feel honored that you even tried to involve him in the first place. You owe that guy nothing more than what you already paid him financially for his services. Go run your tournament, homie.
Black belt 1st degreeVerified
4 year(s) ago
I know now, this is what I should have done. But what can I do to fix it now, now that he has said he doesn't support the event, and he doesn't want me to ask his/ our team to fight at the event.
If you were in a romantic relationship, this type of situation might be a little more difficult to dissect, but you're not, as far as I'm aware.
This side of bjj has always been so, so weird to me...
This side of bjj has always been so, so weird to me...
Black belt 1st degreeVerified
4 year(s) ago
I know now, this is what I should have done. But what can I do to fix it now, now that he has said he doesn't support the event, and he doesn't want me to ask his/ our team to fight at the event.
Two adults who respect each other should be able to fix this with a conversation.
Keep in mind that respect should always go both ways. If he’s not supporting the event and doesn’t want his students to be a part of it just because he wasn’t the first to know then it sounds to me that there’s not much respect for you…
Keep in mind that respect should always go both ways. If he’s not supporting the event and doesn’t want his students to be a part of it just because he wasn’t the first to know then it sounds to me that there’s not much respect for you…
Black belt 4th degreeVerified
4 year(s) ago
We had a very active martial arts community in Denmark in an online forum I created 20+ years ago. There were a lot of entrepreneurial people and a lot of things going on: Events, tournaments, new styles, seminars, new academies. We had ONE rule in the community of thousands of people, that was strongly enforced in the forums:
If you are not the person who took the initiative and made something happen, you shut the f*ck up about it. That simple.
I loved that rule. Even when people disagreed to other people’s projects, they would still defend their right as takers of initiative if someone complained or were negative about the project. “Do it better yourself if you disagree” was the culture.
There will always be resistance. Expect it and ignore it. If I had listened to all the complaints and butthurt people about projects such as Beltchecker or BJJ Globetrotters (and trust me, there has been MANY), these things would never have existed.
You’ve taken the initiative to this idea, nobody else did that and you owe them nothing. Go create something that makes people happy and excited. You don’t ever have to excuse yourself for that. Some people will support it and some will dislike it. Ignore the second group and push on! Who knows where it will take you. And don’t forget, one door closes, another one opens.
I’m excited to follow your event. I have promoted lot, LOT of competitions and events like this and will be happy to give you some input and feedback if you ever need it.
If you are not the person who took the initiative and made something happen, you shut the f*ck up about it. That simple.
I loved that rule. Even when people disagreed to other people’s projects, they would still defend their right as takers of initiative if someone complained or were negative about the project. “Do it better yourself if you disagree” was the culture.
There will always be resistance. Expect it and ignore it. If I had listened to all the complaints and butthurt people about projects such as Beltchecker or BJJ Globetrotters (and trust me, there has been MANY), these things would never have existed.
You’ve taken the initiative to this idea, nobody else did that and you owe them nothing. Go create something that makes people happy and excited. You don’t ever have to excuse yourself for that. Some people will support it and some will dislike it. Ignore the second group and push on! Who knows where it will take you. And don’t forget, one door closes, another one opens.
I’m excited to follow your event. I have promoted lot, LOT of competitions and events like this and will be happy to give you some input and feedback if you ever need it.
Black belt 1st degreeVerified
4 year(s) ago
I have promoted lot, LOT of competitions and events like this and will be happy to give you some input and feedback if you ever need it.
I'd also be happy to help out with any advice that may be helpful to your situation. Fwiw, I helped run national tournaments (in Moldova... as a blue belt) as well as small, local tournaments of all sorts here in the States.
Black belt 2nd degreeVerified
4 year(s) ago
Since when should any adult have anything to say on what businesses other adults want to start.
Well, you might want to still first ask your SO if you want to start a strip club...
There's this thing called communication...
On one hand Gaz didn't have any obligation to involve the coach. And the coach doesn't have any rational reason to be upset. However people are not rational and now Gaz is in a somewhat unpleasant situation, asking for advice on an internet forum.
There's this thing called communication...
On one hand Gaz didn't have any obligation to involve the coach. And the coach doesn't have any rational reason to be upset. However people are not rational and now Gaz is in a somewhat unpleasant situation, asking for advice on an internet forum.
Black belt 4th degreeVerified
4 year(s) ago
I'm not in favor of on kind of "guru" relationship between coach and student, but i still believe with my traditional background that your sensei deserve some respect, and he must take care of you and respect you as well.
When i read those costumer comment like you paid him for his services that's it...it make me sad, i give all i got to my students i dedicaded my live to this and give them the Best i can, i don't do that for 30€/month if i had the ask a price for what i really do it must be impossible to pay for 85% of them for sure, but i want to give the opportunity to anybody to train, even if they had financial problems.
Each case is different and America's still America so my argument gonna sound weird for People who think in the capitalisme prisma but somewhere in the world, old way of training still exist in dojos where respect is more important than money.
One's again my opinion, i never stop any of my guys going to seminars, push them to learn by themselves, to travel and meet others so it is possible to train like that
When i read those costumer comment like you paid him for his services that's it...it make me sad, i give all i got to my students i dedicaded my live to this and give them the Best i can, i don't do that for 30€/month if i had the ask a price for what i really do it must be impossible to pay for 85% of them for sure, but i want to give the opportunity to anybody to train, even if they had financial problems.
Each case is different and America's still America so my argument gonna sound weird for People who think in the capitalisme prisma but somewhere in the world, old way of training still exist in dojos where respect is more important than money.
One's again my opinion, i never stop any of my guys going to seminars, push them to learn by themselves, to travel and meet others so it is possible to train like that
Black belt 4th degreeVerified
4 year(s) ago
But the issue is not if he asked him (he did), the issue is if he asked him FIRST. In my opinion, the coach is demanding “respect” in the wrong way here.
Purple beltVerified
4 year(s) ago
Well to stir the pot more. My brother, who has had zero to do with the arranging of this event, went to the gym today. Only to be stopped by our coach, and told that he is very angry with my brother for organising this (which ive said, he isn't) and told him that he will be angry for a very long time and not to come back to the gym.
I normally go to class on Tuesdays, following my 4 year old sons class.
Ill message my coach in the morning, and I guess ill be at a new gym in the afternoon.
Shame really, I havent started this as a money making thing, only to grow the community. Feels like the opposite is happening right now.
Thank you to everyone that says that they would help. I think I have most things under control....... which just makes me think of one thing...... What unexpected things did you come across while organising an event?
I normally go to class on Tuesdays, following my 4 year old sons class.
Ill message my coach in the morning, and I guess ill be at a new gym in the afternoon.
Shame really, I havent started this as a money making thing, only to grow the community. Feels like the opposite is happening right now.
Thank you to everyone that says that they would help. I think I have most things under control....... which just makes me think of one thing...... What unexpected things did you come across while organising an event?
Black belt 4th degreeVerified
4 year(s) ago
Well to stir the pot more. My brother, who has had zero to do with the arranging of this event, went to the gym today. Only to be stopped by our coach, and told that he is very angry with my brother for organising this (which ive said, he isn't) and told him that he will be angry for a very long time and not to come back to the gym. I normally go to class on Tuesdays, following my 4 year old sons class. Ill message my coach in the morning, and I guess ill be at a new gym in the afternoon. Shame really, I havent started this as a money making thing, only to grow the community. Feels like the opposite is happening right now. Thank you to everyone that says that they would help. I think I have most things under control....... which just makes me think of one thing...... What unexpected things did you come across while organising an event?
Yeah sounds like “that fart has been farted” as we say in Denmark :D :D
I don’t remember many unexpected things but definitely the biggest challenge was always to have enough qualified staff and to make it worth their time. And it sound like all your old friends from the gym are now barred from joining.
I don’t remember many unexpected things but definitely the biggest challenge was always to have enough qualified staff and to make it worth their time. And it sound like all your old friends from the gym are now barred from joining.
Edited 4 year(s) ago
Black belt 4th degreeVerified
4 year(s) ago
Do what you want. Just be repectful to people.
You pay the instructor/gym for a service. It's not the other way around. Too many people forget that little detail.
You pay the instructor/gym for a service. It's not the other way around. Too many people forget that little detail.
Black belt 1st degreeVerified
4 year(s) ago
I guess ill be at a new gym in the afternoon... What unexpected things did you come across while organising an event?
Hope you've been able to find a better gym at which to train by now!
To answer your question, I don't think anything super unexpected came up that we couldn't deal with, but inevitably, small issues would come up. I think the best way to address these issues is kind of like triangle defense: "don't get caught there in the first place".
So, in other words, the best thing to do right now is to brainstorm what your answer would be to various problems such as, what if an important person from the team doesn't show up? What if a referee makes an obviously bad call? What if someone gets injured? What happens when the event location doesn't take care of their responsibility and isn't prepared to host the event? Etc...
To answer your question, I don't think anything super unexpected came up that we couldn't deal with, but inevitably, small issues would come up. I think the best way to address these issues is kind of like triangle defense: "don't get caught there in the first place".
So, in other words, the best thing to do right now is to brainstorm what your answer would be to various problems such as, what if an important person from the team doesn't show up? What if a referee makes an obviously bad call? What if someone gets injured? What happens when the event location doesn't take care of their responsibility and isn't prepared to host the event? Etc...
Purple beltVerified
4 year(s) ago
Great initiative, good luck with everything. There are a lot of clubs in Spain (depending on where you live) but if it's a more or less big city you will find a new place to train.
Black belt 4th degreeVerified
4 year(s) ago
I agree with Benoit about the respect, honor, and loyalty thing and that it is lost today. But I agree with Christian's points of view 100%! As Gaz's old coach, he is an asshat! He seems like the kind of guy that demands blind loyalty and if he's not art the top of the list for everything in your life, he'll get all bent out of shape. Gaz did communicate, his coach can't say he didn't. His coach is acting like a 12 year girl for not being told first. He needs to grow the fuck up! Respect and loyalty is a two way road. It's seems like it's a one way road for Gaz's old coach. Gaz is better off not having anything to do with the guy as a coach or in business!
Black belt 1st degreeVerified
4 year(s) ago
When i read those costumer comment like you paid him for his services that's it...it make me sad, i give all i got to my students i dedicaded my live to this and give them the Best i can, i don't do that for 30€/month if i had the ask a price for what i really do it must be impossible to pay for 85% of them for sure, but i want to give the opportunity to anybody to train, even if they had financial problems. Each case is different and America's still America so my argument gonna sound weird for People who think in the capitalisme prisma but somewhere in the world, old way of training still exist in dojos where respect is more important than money.
I think that as instructors, of course, you most likely do, AND SHOULD, make an effort to put your heart and soul into your work.
And when a student leaves your gym, or you otherwise feel slighted because you perceive that they neglected to put your interests first in their decision-making process, it makes you sad, as you feel like you had connected with this person in a certain way.
However, you have to realize that your heart and soul was not what your student signed up for when they signed up for bjj class. They signed up to train bjj, and they didn't sign up for your heart and soul... at least in most cases, I should imagine.
In this guy's situation, at least how it was presented from one party's perspective, it seems like he was able to be kosher enough from any reasonable standpoint.
I'm not sure what any of this has to do with America or capitalism or whatever.
And when a student leaves your gym, or you otherwise feel slighted because you perceive that they neglected to put your interests first in their decision-making process, it makes you sad, as you feel like you had connected with this person in a certain way.
However, you have to realize that your heart and soul was not what your student signed up for when they signed up for bjj class. They signed up to train bjj, and they didn't sign up for your heart and soul... at least in most cases, I should imagine.
In this guy's situation, at least how it was presented from one party's perspective, it seems like he was able to be kosher enough from any reasonable standpoint.
I'm not sure what any of this has to do with America or capitalism or whatever.
Black belt 4th degreeVerified
4 year(s) ago
However, you have to realize that your heart and soul was not what your student signed up for when they signed up for bjj class. They signed up to train bjj, and they didn't sign up for your heart and soul
This is a damn good point.


