Was it really revoking a promotion if the instructor was simply 'signing off' for the IBJJF registration? Isn't it more like revoking a verification than revoking a confirmation on Beltchecker?

Can you really take back a black belt? You can remove the person from under you.. but that person earned that belt and was recognized to have the knowledge and /or skill to receive a blackbelt.. that's why is important to be careful who you promote to that rank. My 2 cents

As I mentioned in another thread, there is a precedent in academics for revoking undergraduate and graduate degrees due to immoral/illegal activities (https://www.usnews.com/ed[...]re-revoked). It doesn’t mean the perpetrator suddenly loses their knowledge or accomplishments when their degree is revoked, but it is a way for the degree-granting institution to sever ties with a wrongdoer and possibly prevent them from using the degree to further their career. Interestingly, some of the cases in the link above are for honorary doctorates, which is a bit like someone signing off on somebody’s IBJJF black belt registration when they don’t really know them all that well. :)

The verification process by prospective students are also greatly simplified by the vast amounts of meticulous documentation of years in training and lineage by the majority of the BJJ community. Beltchecker and the IBJJF databases also provide invaluable information about instructors.

The problem with that analogy is that a legitimate institute of higher learning has an accreditation that is widely accepted / respected. BJJ is still the wild anarchistic west, and while the IBJJF offers some guidelines and rules to be followed within the organisation, a large percentage of practicioners operate outside of their control. Which I like, actually. It shifts the responsibilty of quality control and 'policing' the scene to the community itself. Daddy Carlinhos won't help us. Do it ourselves. Which is what Beltchecker is for.

Unfortunately, there's quite a lot of members on Beltchecker who claims to have been training for someone for years and still unable to produce a single picture of themselves together with named instructor when asked. And others simply refusing to lowering(?) themselves to upload actual evidence but acting out like snowflakes and revenge voting when called out on it and down voted until evidence has been added. So there's not many on Beltchecker daring to use the down vote and the remaining few are quickly off set with bunches of members just seeming to up vote to maybe get an up vote later themselves and the even more members never reviewing old votes. If frauds, history revisionists and out right criminals are to be stopped from being verified, we (including those being voted on) can't make it just about ourselves. Each person acting out against those down voting for e.g. lack of evidence on the profil is a great help for those who actually don't have the merits or have exaggerated their merits etc. So as of now, a Beltchecker verification doesn't really say much. As of IBJJF, their certifications mean even less, as they are not even transparent (doesn't even say publicly who signed off on them) and more and more evidence comes up of cases where they have quite radically ignored their own promotion requirements, which they both on their homepage and in answers to mails claim are mandatory and never compromised with. There has been several cases of instructors 'signing off' on someone and later distancing themselves from the very same person, saying e.g. they only did a favor for formalities and didn't actually know the person or if his/her degree was legit. Also jumping directly to black with registration (as with Gokor) or accepting instructors never having met the student signing off for black belts (recurring cases with e.g. Checkmat), where Globetrotters (officially) were kicked out of IBJJF for less.

Once again you seem to want to criticize everyone else because they don't uphold your standards. The topic was revoking a Blackbelt.. I get a kick out of how diligent you are about voting but don't seem as upset that people just sign off on Blackbelts for people they have not promoted.. Remember the founders of BJJ were fascist, misogynistic thugs

Can you really take back a black belt? You can remove the person from under you.. but that person earned that belt and was recognized to have the knowledge and /or skill to receive a blackbelt.. that's why is important to be careful who you promote to that rank. My 2 cents

The problem with that analogy is that a legitimate institute of higher learning has an accreditation that is widely accepted / respected.

It depends on the criteria you considered to promote them. If character is one of the requirements and you find out after the fact that the person was a dirt bag it means they never met the requirements. I've got a few professional certificates and licenses and they are all contingent on meeting specific criteria. If I had faked any of those criteria and the organization that endorsed those certificates found out the would revoke my license immediately. I would still have the certificates hanging on the wall to show off, but they would not longer be valid.

But that's the difference on credentials.. if you faked anything to receive those credentials then you weren't qualified to have the recognition in the first place.. if an instructor has a written set of code of conduct to earn a blackbelt and the person meets said criteria up to belt promotion.. then they've earned it.. if there is a set criteria for maintaining your blackbelt under that instructor and it's written and signed by you, with the expressed written understanding that if you don't meet certain criteria, your belt and rank can be revoked..then yes then it meets the same criteria as credentialing

'Revoking a belt' if earned, seems to me like someone trying to cover their ass and reputation. The genie is already out of the bottle and there is no turning back. So you gave the belt and the person turned out to be a huge POS criminal etc., so what, that doesn't make the promoter of said POS a bad person or irresponsible in anyway. How were they to know when this person is pretending to be someone they are not and believe me, these individuals are great at fooling people. Otherwise they would have been out of the sexual assault/molesting business a long time ago. The play should be cutting all ties to that person. Banning them from your association, club or whatever and if you feel the need make a statement about how you had no idea this person was a (insert label here). Hell put up an old western type poster of the guy in your academy and street poles. Will their elementary or high schools revoke their diplomas. How about their driver license? Does that get revoked as well? Turn off their utilities etc. Where does it end? The justice system will either hold them accountable or it will fail to hold them accountable. All we can do is cut our ties with that individual and make sure they never set foot on our mats, and if possible, through word of mouth or multiple media platforms, get the word out so noone else ties their good name with the individual in question. Just my 2¢ for what it's worth. https://www.youtube.com/w[...]SVASN8OsVs

Dave, you hit the nail on the head. And again, proves that 'signing off' on a black belt is a bad idea. You either promote someone, while taking into account both their skill & character - because that individual's name will forever be tied to yours. Or you dont.

Yeah, I think I'd agree with that. If you legit earned a black belt, you're still a black belt regardless of whether you have a political falling out with your instructor (or something more serious, like the sex offender guy situation).

There's a difference between an annulment and a divorce.