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2 year(s) ago • 22486 views • 45 replies

Thomas Jankowski
Thomas Jankowski
Purple beltVerified2 forum posts795/400
2 year(s) ago
Compared to whatever 'standard' lifting program, if it's supposed to complement grappling, I would - not use low rep ranges - use way more unilateral work than those - try to taylor it's focus to best prevent injuries that this specific person tends to get in grappling (e.g. in my case - I tend to get minor hamstring tears, never quad tears so I'd choose leg focus accordingly)
It still depends on what the goals are.
If you're trying to develop "strength" going over 5 reps is usually going to hinder that somewhat.
If you're trying to grow muscle it's more about total volume
If you're trying to just prevent injuries then you need to grow strength in movements/muscles that are susceptible depending on the way you play... I wouldn't say it's about rep-ranges, more addressing the issues at hand. Hamstring injuries occur when weak/tight hamstrings are stretched and contracted beyond their capabilities.

Now, as far as beating yourself up from training, the best thing you can do is condition your body aerobically to handle to load AND stay away from failure... you could even go as far as stopping as soon as you feel reps start to slow down.

Well, there is my first post on Beltchecker
Randy
Randy
Black belt 1st degreeVerified267 forum posts3345/1000
2 year(s) ago
It still depends on what the goals are. If you're trying to develop 'strength' going over 5 reps is usually going to hinder that somewhat. If you're trying to grow muscle it's more about total volume If you're trying to just prevent injuries then you need to grow strength in movements/muscles that are susceptible depending on the way you play... I wouldn't say it's about rep-ranges, more addressing the issues at hand. Hamstring injuries occur when weak/tight hamstrings are stretched and contracted beyond their capabilities. Now, as far as beating yourself up from training, the best thing you can do is condition your body aerobically to handle to load AND stay away from failure... you could even go as far as stopping as soon as you feel reps start to slow down. Well, there is my first post on Beltchecker
Solid first post. Welcome!
Coachpotato
Coachpotato
Black belt 1st degreeVerified776 forum posts1920/1000
2 year(s) ago
With "jesus" in your blood and açaí in your recovery drink, you can do whatever exercises, reps and weights. 😁
Jon
Jon
Purple beltVerified89 forum posts1345/400
2 year(s) ago
I do a 5x5 weight training programme, kettlebells, bodyweight, joint mobility, etc. because I'm old and injured.
I'd advise against 5x5 because 5 rep range demands that you use higher weights which are harder on your joints. If you switch for 3x10-15 or even 2x20 you can reduce the weigh significantly and save your tendons. Even dedicated power lifters can only do 5x5 for a mesocycle at a time.
Vince Choo
Vince Choo
Black belt 3rd degreeVerified1126 forum posts21045/1000
2 year(s) ago
I'd advise against 5x5 because 5 rep range demands that you use higher weights which are harder on your joints. If you switch for 3x10-15 or even 2x20 you can reduce the weigh significantly and save your tendons. Even dedicated power lifters can only do 5x5 for a mesocycle at a time.
I've since discovered this since I tweaked my back from the back squats and have been taking a week off to recover. Thanks for this insight
Coachpotato
Coachpotato
Black belt 1st degreeVerified776 forum posts1920/1000
2 year(s) ago
5x5 is just fine if you don't go past 80%.

And really, it's not about amount of reps, but the quality of reps and time under tension.

That 3x10 or 2x20 just leads to fatique, which is not what we want. You can of course rep out if you use baby weights, but those don't give any gains in strength.
Vince Choo
Vince Choo
Black belt 3rd degreeVerified1126 forum posts21045/1000
2 year(s) ago
5x5 is just fine if you don't go past 80%. And really, it's not about amount of reps, but the quality of reps and time under tension. That 3x10 or 2x20 just leads to fatique, which is not what we want. You can of course rep out if you use baby weights, but those don't give any gains in strength.
I tried doing 3x10 yesterday and yes you're right, fatigue in the last set resulting in poor form
Thomas Jankowski
Thomas Jankowski
Purple beltVerified2 forum posts795/400
2 year(s) ago
You guys could be interested in this concept I've used with athletes in-season (I work with Rugby Players) called hypertrophy clusters.
I've started applying it to bjj too, and could even work great as energy system training.
Essentially you take the same weight you've use for 4x10, but instead do 8x5, with less rest (say 30-60s). There's studies that show when volume is equated, growth will be the same anyway. BUT when staying further away from failure, power and strength goes up.
Plus, because you'll avoid that fatigue that can lead to injury/crappy sessions.

I've done this with 8x5 and then 10x4, slowly upping weight.

The reality is for BJJ there are so many ways to work it, but for me this ticks a lot of boxes. Depending on how intense/frequent your bjj is would dictate how often you lift, which probably has a bigger bearing on injury/fatigue than any of these specifics
Jorgen Matsi
Jorgen Matsi
Black belt 2nd degreeVerified1772 forum posts17465/1000
2 year(s) ago
I think people are too stuck on fixed reps x sets. Keep good form, go high on subjective intensity in a set but keep it safe and then do the math after.

E.g. if I in my "program" might have a 3x10x70kg it might ACTUALLY look like

1st set 12x70 kg
2nd set 9x75 kg
3rd set 8x75 kg

(Not going to failure, keeping subjective 1-2 reps in reserve. Total volume 2115 kg)

Taking the knowledge of that day, the next time I'm doing the same exercise, it might look like this:

1st set 10x75 kg
2nd set 9x75 kg
3rd set 11x70kg

Total volume: 2145 kg

Progress!
Jon
Jon
Purple beltVerified89 forum posts1345/400
2 year(s) ago
In most cases, a one rep max is just as fatiguing on the body as lifting lighter weights to failure. Same should apply at all rep ranges when lifting to the magical 2 reps in reserve. The main difference being that old men shouldn't do 1 rep maxes, or even heavy lifting because our connective tissue lacks plasticity as we age. Lifting 8X5 for low weight is intriguing, but I caution any old men about doing ego lifts to fight against going softly into the dark night. You'll gain plenty strength at high rep ranges and relatively low weights. And you should be fatigued after you leave the weight room or your wasting your time; time you could be just cuddle wrestling.
Coachpotato
Coachpotato
Black belt 1st degreeVerified776 forum posts1920/1000
2 year(s) ago
You guys could be interested in this concept I've used with athletes in-season (I work with Rugby Players) called hypertrophy clusters. I've started applying it to bjj too, and could even work great as energy system training. Essentially you take the same weight you've use for 4x10, but instead do 8x5, with less rest (say 30-60s). There's studies that show when volume is equated, growth will be the same anyway. BUT when staying further away from failure, power and strength goes up. Plus, because you'll avoid that fatigue that can lead to injury/crappy sessions. I've done this with 8x5 and then 10x4, slowly upping weight. The reality is for BJJ there are so many ways to work it, but for me this ticks a lot of boxes. Depending on how intense/frequent your bjj is would dictate how often you lift, which probably has a bigger bearing on injury/fatigue than any of these specifics
It's good programming for compound lifts. I've had good results with hockey players and one shot put athlete. Paired with light unilateral assistance work and upper body hypertrophy.

^^1rm is "never" done in supplemental strength training and should only be done when peaking for competition for strength sports. Unless you're doing the bulgarian insanity, that's just maxing out every day. :D
Mirco
Mirco
Brown beltVerified805 forum posts5080/700
2 year(s) ago
Within the last 20 years I almost tried everything in relation to S&C training.
From Olympic lifts, via Kettlebell Fitness and TRX suspension training, strength protocols like 5x5, „classical“ bodybuilding, bodyweight exercises, you name it….

Don’t get me wrong, with almost 47, I don’t feel old, but under the given (individual) circumstances, for me works best „classical“ weight training, covering the basic core exercises and movements, push, pull, squat, hinge: dumbbell/barbell presses, rows/ pull ups/ Squats and deadlifts on the days I don’t train BJJ.
In my (subjective)opinion, time under tension for me works great, as i don’t get problems with tendons or joints (4 sets, 8-12).
But I have to say, I don’t lift or do S&C to supplement my BJJ, but to have a general purpose preparation and staying fit and healthy the older I get.
Of course it also helps in my BJJ (only 3 times a week), but in my main job as prison officer and DT instructor I really have to have a decent fitness level.
So I think I found a good balance juggling my main profession, family commitments, BJJ training and S&C without having to much stress and without having negative effects on recovery or health
Zy Pryde-Ramsey
Zy Pryde-Ramsey
Blue beltVerified37 forum posts1415/200
2 year(s) ago
I think for me personally, I am lucky to have a gym that comes with a strength and conditioning program. Granted, time on the mat will always do its thing, but the mobility, and conditioning that I get from my trainer is definitely an edge that I have over other heavyweights I compete against. At least at the lower levels and this local circuit. I definitely think its a plus to my game.
Matthew Isaacs
Matthew Isaacs
Purple beltVerified5 forum posts845/400
2 year(s) ago
A few months ago I switched over to using the Dominate the Mats program from Sweet Science of Fighting. It has totally changed my gas tank and I don't ever feel overtrained. The guy who runs it has a great podcast as well, and a subscription also comes with a discord invite where you get 24/7 support. If I have a question about what I'm doing, techniques, training during injuries etc I can post there and the owner responds within a couple hours. It's amazing. It's on the expensive side, but in my opinion worth it.
Philip Dunlap
Philip Dunlap
Black belt 3rd degreeVerified1043 forum posts59560/1000
2 year(s) ago
When I lift I train the kinetic chains I use for both striking and grappling while also doing some work to correct the imbalances created by our sport. The think people need to realize is just like with diet everybody is different and responds differently.

As an older athlete I have needed to learn the most important thing is to listen to my body as in my younger days I was a chronic overtrainer

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