What earlier standard or organization don't count time since the original BB promotion date verified by that organization? With IBJJF for instance, you can wait and get several BB degrees on the same day, as long as the total time is correct. You can also check on my old votes that this is also the way I myself vote. I'm actually a bit more flexible than IBJJF on the earlier belts, where I'm ok with shorter periods in a belt when it's evened out with longer times in others (e.g. you being blue belt for less than a year). So what glass houses are you talking about? Rather sounds like a straw man, which you yourself like to complaining about ('man ska inte kasta sten i glashus' is what we say in Sweden). You also like to complain about absurd extreme cases but don't hesitate a second to suggest a basis for down voting based on previous stripes on black not having been awarded spread out over the years and implicitly that this way of voting would only be targeted at me, which I'm supposed to see as being a pure coincidence and not a revenge vote. That's just being silly.

Yes, that's true. It's an obnoxious stain of red to have on your profile, would be nice if one could indicate nuance between 'I think this person may have the skills but technically they didn't follow MY ideal rules for promotions' and 'I think this person is a fraud'; in general, I think most interpret a dispute as being for the latter. But that's a bit of a cop-out of a reply. You aren't violating any rules of the website, and no one says you are. But you are clearly against the concensus here in your voting standards, so you should be aware of that. You're going off on your own. Do not make any mistake in believing that others here stand behind you on your mission that you frankly cannot even begin to justify here when pressed.

> What earlier standard or organization don't count time since the original BB promotion date verified by that organization? There is effectively no org other than the IBJJF (ignoring Rickson's alt org that never seemed to really take off?). Before the IBJJf, though, I'd never heard of instructors putting three stripes on a black belt in one go just to catch up... I _do_ know of cases where people had felt forgotten by their instructor and fell behind, left at a rank too long, and tough luck, that's just how it is. And I do know that would have been suspicious. The IBJJF giving allowing pure time-in-grade promotions as legit, without an instructor, I think was seen by most as kind of scandalous and was just something most people weren't aware of (and frankly most still aren't). And yet again, you argue in bad faith. I'm not giving a straw man, I'm pointing out that you're flexible where it serves you and rigid where you arbitrarily decide to be. This is a legitimate comparison, unlike the ones you make. Your detractors on your profile are right to call you a troll. More people seem to have issue with someone getting three stripes on a black belt in one day, including the third one 4 months early, than have problems with the issues you choose to downvote for. > You also like to complain about absurd extreme cases but don't hesitate a second to suggest a basis for down voting based on previous stripes on black not having been awarded spread out over the years and implicitly that this way of voting would only be targeted at me, which I'm supposed to see as being a pure coincidence and not a revenge vote. I don't mean this in a rude way, I know I'm a native english speaker and you aren't, but this is a hard sentence to understand. It seems you're trying to claim I'm being threatening rather than just making a legitimate argument. To me, the issue with your profile is at least equally, if not more, 'technically improper' than the issue you seem to have here. This is a legitimate argument. I find your behavior and the mismatch between your profile and the way you downvote genuinely strange. And it seems other do as well. I'm not going to downvote you, because I actually am flexible with this kind of stuff and don't really think you're not legit and that black belt degrees are mostly bogus, so some flexibility with how you deal with it is fine to me, but rather than having sympathy for your downvotes, I instead feel some schadenfreude. You really deserve that taste of your own medicine. I wish you were more reasonable, because I think having someone actually care enough to dig into profiles is good for the community, but you're focusing on the wrong things, and doing at least as much harm as good to the community, and honestly, likely on the side of more harm.

I totally agree with that nuance in votes would be a welcome addition. Just as nuances in your claims of me being on my own and without others standing behind me.

You need to check your bogus math. When is nine years (3+3+3) after September 6, 2014 and is my promotion date to third degree (October 29, 2023) after that date or four months before?

Sorry, you are correct on this point. Your profile is confusing because you have 8 years, 8 months, followed by 5 months at a rank, and then another promotion. The '0 years, 5 months' blends into the 0 years of the prior two degrees. ...but it's a subtle and mostly irrelevant response. Because the point is just that if you choose to be picky and legalistic unnecessarily, you can pick apart your promotion history, which is still true--you just personally find it to be a less grievous and acceptable error. As for Covid, that was 4 years ago, not 8. And sure, things happen! As I said, I'm not downvoting your profile, because I'm perfectly fine with this kind of exception. I just don't arbitrarily decide to be hyper strict with other rules in an inconsistent manner. I'm loose with all of them. My point is _you_ are fine with exceptions that serve _your_ history, without realizing that others are bending the rules slightly at times that are equally valid.

What exceptions to what rules serve my history? | What is questionable with my background?

Jonah, I'm curious what you expect of people who have been promoted (to black belt we'll say), but their promoting instructor doesn't meet your standards, and therefore they don't meet your standards? Do you want them to go back to a previous belt until they can be promoted by someone you approve? Do you want them to find a new instructor who will sign off on the legitimacy of them receiving that belt? Like when you say So and So shouldn't have promoted you because in 2010 they weren't a 2nd degree black belt. What then?

Exception: Getting two ranks on the same day. Exception: holding a black belt rank for 5 months. > I think we can just settle with concluding that our senses of logic have irreconcilable differences. I'm disappointed, but not surprised. You have avoided most of the points made. You sadly don't seem like the type to be willing to reconsider his positions when presented with contradictions, otherwise this conversation wouldn't be happening in the first place. To bring this thread back: I do think revenge voting has the potential to be a serious issue, and is a tricky concept to deal with. I do have to reflect on, if I ever contest someone's rank, whether I am willing to risk my profile being 'pristine' and getting tarnished by a revenge vote. That hurts the viability of this project--it takes a lot of conviction to risk it. Unfortunately, your choices and habits here are unpopular enough that you make a bad example case. If someone who was more likable were subject to this, people might be more concerned with doing something, but as you can see, the general concensus here is 'well, to be honest, you're kind of asking for it,' and they mostly have sympathy with the people you're disputing. Do you really not have any sense that maybe you should reflect on this situation? Is everyone else here really wrong? What are you accomplishing--is your standard or choice making jiu jitsu better, really doing anything to protect the sport, or are you just fighting for a cause with no purpose? To be clear, I don't even dislike or hold anything against you, personally, I can even relate to you. I think I probably came off more like you in the past. You're probably a generally likable guy in person, and I don't doubt your jiu jitsu. Your desire to validate and check in on things is actually something that could be valuable to the community, but you're just a little too trigger happy and aggressive and disconnected from the community to actually do anything that's of any value to anyone. In fact, you actually hurt the entire belt checker project; if my profile had a 'dispute' because someone had some personal rule they really cared about that my profile didn't match, it would be most likely to just turn me off of the website, less likely to recommend students use it, and less likely to use it as a resource for my legitimacy. I do hope you reconsider your choices and add some nuance and flexibility to your voting criteria.

> Catching up on 2 degrees after nearly 9 years, and then a third degree 5 months later. That isn't 'kosher' for those who want to really stick it. Who are those 'those' you are referring to? Can you point me to a profile on Beltchecker (besides mine) where someone has been down voted on the issue? Or forum posts or articles here or somewhere else which supports your claims of the existence of those 'those'? Are belts themselves making BJJ better? You obviously can do without in e.g. boxing, wrestling, MMA and submission wrestling. But now we do and it obviously has some importance as time and resources have been spent at making Beltchecker, which has amassed tens of thousands of members. What then is so unlikeable with voting according to your take on what the degrees should be, according to rule based standards (which is what e.g. IBJJF does to)? Have you seen anyone else on Beltchecker even attempting to be anywhere neare as transparent, fine granular and objective with integrity in their rule based voting? Believe it or not, but I have a life outside of Beltchecker and really don't think it's worth my time to answer every single detail of the very long posts you make in rapid succession. So I focus in my replies on what I see as key issues and the most obvious logical fallacies. Btw, who gave you the authority to decide what the general consensus on Beltchecker is? Is it those 'those' again? P.S. I see you have competed in wrestling but I dispute you having a black belt in it. How does that make you feel? :-)

I have however expressed many times that I'm quite liberal with switching formal promoting instructor to someone legit who you had a student relation with at the time or at least someone further up the lineage who would know who you are. With the case where several generations of BB:s had promoted new generations when they were no degree or recent one degree BB:s, that would however mean that someone several steps up the lineage would need to be the formal promoting instructor (with evidence showing it). No such attempts to fix the promotion history have been made.

I've seen maximum security prisons that are more liberal

I knew subscribing to this would be entertaining.

I am at the point where I think he does these posts for attention.. The debate on voting criteria has been to the point the horse we were kicking is now a puddle

I am at the point where I think he does these posts for attention.. The debate on voting criteria has been to the point the horse we were kicking is now a puddle We are all free to vote the way we like but when he gets a backlash he feels the need to cry foul and play the victim and any counter point gets a response where he pulls at an off point thread and goes on a run. Drop a question when verifying don't get a response put the question on their wall.. No answer don't vote. You vote to dispute you are calling them a fraud