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How is this an alternative to IBJJF?
6 year(s) ago • 209459 views • 216 replies
CGBlack belt 4th degreeVerified
6 year(s) ago
In this video he is wearing a black belt? Also on many photos on the academy facebook page even back to 2016. Did he get promoted to black and then got it taken away after the split from his instructor? https://www.youtube.com/w[...]=emb_title
Aaaand he deleted his profile :)
RDBlack belt 4th degreeVerified
CGBlack belt 4th degreeVerified
6 year(s) ago
Who knows. Looks like Beltchecker has a pretty high succes rate on actually checking belts, so far :D
FGBlack belt 3rd degreeVerified
6 year(s) ago
Who knows. Looks like Beltchecker has a pretty high succes rate on actually checking belts, so far :D
Agreed! That is exactly why Beltchecker could actually rival the IBJJF!
ALBlack belt 1st degreeVerified
6 year(s) ago
I'm not a member, competitor for, or fan of the IBJJF and their monetary based politics. For my small and rural location, they simply aren't relevant. I think Beltchecker is a wonderful alternative.
I really also love that Beltchecker is "peer reviewed" by the community, rather than "fee" based. In the old days of the Underground and NHBgear forums, we often spoke of the "BJJ Police" in regards to exposing fake belts and such; this is a brilliant and honorable embodiment and evolution of that very purpose.
I have been voted for by, and also voted for, others whom I have no real-world association or acquaintance with. I think it was necessary to get the site up and going in the beginning, but as the site membership continues to grow, I find myself more and more of the inclination of only approving those people who I either know in-person, have personal knowledge of (through local community, affiliation networks, celebrity recognition, etc.) or those whom I have seen in competition.
I think that ultimately, the strength of Beltchecker, just like Jiu-Jitsu itself, is going to be its ability to both adapt to the needs of the moment as it continues to evolve, and of weeding out the "talkers" (frauds/fake belts) from those of us who actually walk the walk (and roll the rolls? LOL)
I really also love that Beltchecker is "peer reviewed" by the community, rather than "fee" based. In the old days of the Underground and NHBgear forums, we often spoke of the "BJJ Police" in regards to exposing fake belts and such; this is a brilliant and honorable embodiment and evolution of that very purpose.
I have been voted for by, and also voted for, others whom I have no real-world association or acquaintance with. I think it was necessary to get the site up and going in the beginning, but as the site membership continues to grow, I find myself more and more of the inclination of only approving those people who I either know in-person, have personal knowledge of (through local community, affiliation networks, celebrity recognition, etc.) or those whom I have seen in competition.
I think that ultimately, the strength of Beltchecker, just like Jiu-Jitsu itself, is going to be its ability to both adapt to the needs of the moment as it continues to evolve, and of weeding out the "talkers" (frauds/fake belts) from those of us who actually walk the walk (and roll the rolls? LOL)
CMBlack beltVerifiedScotland
6 year(s) ago
I think the smooth comp link should certainly help people who have competed recently get verified.
CGBlack belt 4th degreeVerified
6 year(s) ago
I think the smooth comp link should certainly help people who have competed recently get verified.
Verification is purely by community vote. But people could of course decide to vote on those with Smoothcomp profiles and recent competition matches :)
BCBlack beltVerified
6 year(s) ago
Does the verification rate include the deleted profiles? I don't know if it is a good idea, but, I would love to look at the wall of shame of people who tried to fake their belt rank. It might be a liability issue. At a minimum, it would be interesting to see how many verified people there are compared to how many accounts were ever created.
CGBlack belt 4th degreeVerified
6 year(s) ago
Does the verification rate include the deleted profiles? I don't know if it is a good idea, but, I would love to look at the wall of shame of people who tried to fake their belt rank. It might be a liability issue. At a minimum, it would be interesting to see how many verified people there are compared to how many accounts were ever created.
No we can not keep any data on deleted profiles :)
BCBlack beltVerified
6 year(s) ago
Then it makes sense that the verified rate is high. No one is hanging around after they are outed. I doubt many people would try it anyway.
CGBlack belt 4th degreeVerified
6 year(s) ago
Then it makes sense that the verified rate is high. No one is hanging around after they are outed. I doubt many people would try it anyway.
I don't even remember any actual "fake belts" has been here since we launched. A few controversial for various reasons, but none that were outed as selfpromoted or something like that.
JMBlack belt 2nd degreeVerified
6 year(s) ago
No we can not keep any data on deleted profiles :)
Theoretically you could keep stats e.g. how many profiles have been deleted. Data can be kept if it is non-personalized.
I would say if fake belts don't come here or get lost quick - then the system is already working well.
I would say if fake belts don't come here or get lost quick - then the system is already working well.
JMBlack belt 2nd degreeVerified
6 year(s) ago
But obviously my last statement in previous post is a bit akin to ...
"Do you know that snapping your fingers keeps away tigers?"
/snaps fingers
"See, it's working!"
"Do you know that snapping your fingers keeps away tigers?"
/snaps fingers
"See, it's working!"
CCBlack belt 4th degreeVerified
6 year(s) ago
All great points. I think that the sleuthing that goes into a vote is excellent. I truly feel that it would be difficult for someone to come here and be a fraud. They would get detected very quickly. While i see how there could be inherent weaknesses to simply voting for a profile based on pictures, this can also be an inherently good thing. Pictures can tell a perfectly clear story and can validate nearly unquestionably, a persons legitimacy. I know i was concerned about this when i created my account so i made sure to include plenty of pictures with my professors. One of which was of him actually tying my belt on me with the degrees clearly visible. I also included photos of my certificates. I think that as the site grows, those of you who have done so well thus far will continue to provide an effective deterrent to those dishonest few who seek legitimacy through the site. Your efforts at shielding our community are to be commended.
MDBlack belt 2nd degreeVerified
6 year(s) ago
There are all kinds of issues that we can pick apart about the whole thing, and in the end, no system will ever be "perfect."
But the simple fact that there is a viable, community-based alternative to the IBJJF makes this entire venture worthwhile, to me.
If you're going to overthrow a totalitarian regime, you have to start with a community. ;-)
But the simple fact that there is a viable, community-based alternative to the IBJJF makes this entire venture worthwhile, to me.
If you're going to overthrow a totalitarian regime, you have to start with a community. ;-)
VCBlack belt 3rd degreeVerified
6 year(s) ago
5th degree and OG (Yamato Damashii / Purebred Guam founder) Enson Inoue's rank NOT recognised by IBJJF
More: https://www.youtube.com/w[...]KqwHwDfxes
More: https://www.youtube.com/w[...]KqwHwDfxes
BWBlack belt 1st degreeVerified
6 year(s) ago
I love the part where Enson points out he was awarded his black belt 3 years before ibjjf existed. Haha
CGBlack belt 4th degreeVerified
6 year(s) ago
I think it's a bit silly to be honest, of course he can not claim the degrees there because they make the rules and their rules are quite clear. They also don't "recognize" Rickson, Machados, etc. but it's no big deal because it's just a competition and these people are not competing there. If the issue is that he just wants his students to compete at the IBJJF, I am sure that he can get verified as a black belt and sign the forms. Nobody cares how many degrees is on his membership record; it has nothing to do with his actual rank (=how many years he has been a black belt).
It's like saying "NAGA will let me and my students compete but I can only sign up as a black belt, not a 5th degree black belt!!!OMGOMG". Literally couldn't matter less.
It's like saying "NAGA will let me and my students compete but I can only sign up as a black belt, not a 5th degree black belt!!!OMGOMG". Literally couldn't matter less.
Edited 6 year(s) ago
BWBlack belt 1st degreeVerified
6 year(s) ago
If you're a probationary black belt can you register your own team? Sound like that was the main goal, so his students could compete under their own team name.
WMBlack belt 5th degreeVerified
6 year(s) ago
It's like saying 'NAGA will let me and my students compete but I can only sign up as a black belt, not a 5th degree black belt!!!OMGOMG'. Literally couldn't matter less.
The 2nd degree matters as it relates to the ability of a coach to promote and sign for other people to be competitor black belts, as well as signing for people to have black belt signing privileges as coaches within that competition venue, and it is also a tradition that many lineages adhere to, ie that one must be one or two degrees higher than black belt to promote others to black belt.
CGBlack belt 4th degreeVerified
6 year(s) ago
The 2nd degree matters as it relates to the ability of a coach to promote and sign for other people to be competitor black belts, as well as signing for people to have black belt signing privileges as coaches within that competition venue, and it is also a tradition that many lineages adhere to, ie that one must be one or two degrees higher than black belt to promote others to black belt.
I think there's a general confusion between signing a form for IBJJF competitions and then promoting people / the ability to promote them. IBJJF is purposely blurring the line between those two distinct things. But having 2+ degrees and being able to promote black belts has literally nothing to do with what a private competition organizer thinks about you.
If he or his students just want to compete with the IBJJF it should be fairly easy to solve that issue with help from a few friends I'm sure they have in the community. But that doesn't seem to be the real issue.
If he or his students just want to compete with the IBJJF it should be fairly easy to solve that issue with help from a few friends I'm sure they have in the community. But that doesn't seem to be the real issue.
VCBlack belt 3rd degreeVerified
6 year(s) ago
I think it's a bit silly to be honest, of course he can not claim the degrees there because they make the rules and their rules are quite clear. They also don't 'recognize' Rickson, Machados, etc. but it's no big deal because it's just a competition and these people are not competing there. If the issue is that he just wants his students to compete at the IBJJF, I am sure that he can get verified as a black belt and sign the forms. Nobody cares how many degrees is on his membership record; it has nothing to do with his actual rank (=how many years he has been a black belt). It's like saying 'NAGA will let me and my students compete but I can only sign up as a black belt, not a 5th degree black belt!!!OMGOMG'. Literally couldn't matter less.
there's also the $ for the black belt, $ for each degree and $ to backpay for the missing years of 'membership' to enable to sign off for his students to compete. makes no sense when Enson isn't even the one competing and is a clear money grab
RDBlack belt 4th degreeVerified
6 year(s) ago
there's also the $ for the black belt, $ for each degree and $ to backpay for the missing years of 'membership' to enable to sign off for his students to compete. makes no sense when Enson isn't even the one competing and is a clear money grab
They don't allow back paying for missed years.
CGBlack belt 4th degreeVerified
6 year(s) ago
there's also the $ for the black belt, $ for each degree and $ to backpay for the missing years of 'membership' to enable to sign off for his students to compete. makes no sense when Enson isn't even the one competing and is a clear money grab
- There's no back paying
- It is not a requirement for him to register all of his degrees
- The payment is not for each degree (I could for instance jump from 0 degrees to 2 degrees with IBJJF now but I would only have to pay once for that)
- He does not have to certify his rank with IBJJF to sign off for his students. ALL he has to get is a $40/year regular membership. The certification is a completely separate thing.
So many misunderstandings here :D
- It is not a requirement for him to register all of his degrees
- The payment is not for each degree (I could for instance jump from 0 degrees to 2 degrees with IBJJF now but I would only have to pay once for that)
- He does not have to certify his rank with IBJJF to sign off for his students. ALL he has to get is a $40/year regular membership. The certification is a completely separate thing.
So many misunderstandings here :D
VCBlack belt 3rd degreeVerified
6 year(s) ago
- There's no back paying - It is not a requirement for him to register all of his degrees - The payment is not for each degree (I could for instance jump from 0 degrees to 2 degrees with IBJJF now but I would only have to pay once for that) - He does not have to certify his rank with IBJJF to sign off for his students. ALL he has to get is a $40/year regular membership. The certification is a completely separate thing. So many misunderstandings here :D
Thanks for the clarification. I was informed otherwise
ABBlack belt 1st degreeVerified
5 year(s) ago
Agreed, this is how it's supposed to work. If it were only friends, people coming in with no connections to verified people on the platform would be impossible to get verified. Also. you are putting your name + face there on your verification (and a link to your profile), so that should make voters to do at least some research before publicly vouching for a person even here.
Hello Sir. I put my certificate, I thought it would help people. Plus i was lucky to have some team members worldwide on belt checker, i am almost their haha 5 points more,
ABlack belt 3rd degreeVerified
5 year(s) ago
Also seems Ibjjf due to pandemic gave one year extension :)
MRBlack beltVerified
5 year(s) ago
The 2 things that stand out for me about Belt Checker are that it's firstly not based on money. IBJJF & individual affiliations have a financial relationship with their students which IMO always has the potential to complicate promotion in general. Secondly when anyone votes for a person on Belt Checker they are verifying someone outside of the whole lineage concept. We still hold this idea as a benchmark but it's all so subjective anyway, with people disagreeing on how someone show be measured for promotion & what lineages are legit anyway.
As Christian talked about on one of his podcasts, promotion as we've known it is based on relationships & it's is a form of social approval. Belt Checker is the same really. The great difference with Belt Checker is not that it's necessarily any more stringent but that the element for conflicts of interest due to financial payments has been taken out of the equation.
As Christian talked about on one of his podcasts, promotion as we've known it is based on relationships & it's is a form of social approval. Belt Checker is the same really. The great difference with Belt Checker is not that it's necessarily any more stringent but that the element for conflicts of interest due to financial payments has been taken out of the equation.
ABlack belt 3rd degreeVerified
5 year(s) ago
The 2 things that stand out for me about Belt Checker are that it's firstly not based on money. IBJJF & individual affiliations have a financial relationship with their students which IMO always has the potential to complicate promotion in general. Secondly when anyone votes for a person on Belt Checker they are verifying someone outside of the whole lineage concept. We still hold this idea as a benchmark but it's all so subjective anyway, with people disagreeing on how someone show be measured for promotion & what lineages are legit anyway. As Christian talked about on one of his podcasts, promotion as we've known it is based on relationships & it's is a form of social approval. Belt Checker is the same really. The great difference with Belt Checker is not that it's necessarily any more stringent but that the element for conflicts of interest due to financial payments has been taken out of the equation.
1. Everything is based on money one way or the other.(and that’s not good or bad it’s about how you use it)
2. Yes financial relationships has the potential to complicate promotion in general.
3. SOCIAL relationships though as Well...
In most of cases when we vote for a user we vote based on his CV his/hers photos of promotion and who his or hers is the professor that made promotion. If there are more, like Ibjjf certificate or competitions even better chances to be voted.
So in other words all of the above that we use as criteria to vote here on beltchecker are based on financial relationships. Personally I never charged a cent to promote someone BUT I don’t teach for Free (done that as well on occasion when I was young and stupid)
Financial relationships are not out of the equation at all from my point of view. And of course Lineage is one of the criteria.
I enjoy this website for this very reason YOU can put your story up in detail for everyone to see, that’s something Ibjjf doesn’t have. To me it’s a like a pulpic database.
2. Yes financial relationships has the potential to complicate promotion in general.
3. SOCIAL relationships though as Well...
In most of cases when we vote for a user we vote based on his CV his/hers photos of promotion and who his or hers is the professor that made promotion. If there are more, like Ibjjf certificate or competitions even better chances to be voted.
So in other words all of the above that we use as criteria to vote here on beltchecker are based on financial relationships. Personally I never charged a cent to promote someone BUT I don’t teach for Free (done that as well on occasion when I was young and stupid)
Financial relationships are not out of the equation at all from my point of view. And of course Lineage is one of the criteria.
I enjoy this website for this very reason YOU can put your story up in detail for everyone to see, that’s something Ibjjf doesn’t have. To me it’s a like a pulpic database.
MTBlack belt 3rd degreeVerified
5 year(s) ago
The 2nd degree matters as it relates to the ability of a coach to promote and sign for other people to be competitor black belts, as well as signing for people to have black belt signing privileges as coaches within that competition venue, and it is also a tradition that many lineages adhere to, ie that one must be one or two degrees higher than black belt to promote others to black belt.
Didn’t IBJJF change that to 3rd degree?
